"Yes," I said, "but consider, must not the safety of society be
safeguarded by some punishment?"

"There, neighbour!" said the old man, with some exultation "You have
hit the mark. That PUNISHMENT of which men used to talk so wisely
and act so foolishly, what was it but the expression of their fear?
And they had need to fear, since they--i.e., the rulers of society--
were dwelling like an armed band in a hostile country. But we who
live amongst our friends need neither fear nor punish. Surely if we,
in dread of an occasional rare homicide, an occasional rough blow,
were solemnly and legally to commit homicide and violence, we could
only be a society of ferocious cowards. Don't you think so,
neighbour?"

"Yes, I do, when I come to think of it from that side," said I.

"Yet you must understand," said the old man, "that when any violence
is committed, we expect the transgressor to make any atonement
possible to him, and he himself expects it. But again, think if the
destruction or serious injury of a man momentarily overcome by wrath
or folly can be any atonement to the commonwealth? Surely it can
only be an additional injury to it."

Said I: "But suppose the man has a habit of violence,--kills a man a
year, for instance?"

"Such a thing is unknown," said he. "In a society where there is no
punishment to evade, no law to triumph over, remorse will certainly
follow transgression."