there to my office, whither Shales came and I had much discourse with him
about the business of the victualling, and thence in the evening to the
Coffee-house, and there sat till by and by, by appointment Will brought me
word that his uncle Blackburne was ready to speak with me. So I went down
to him, and he and I to a taverne hard by, and there I begun to speak to
Will friendlily, advising him how to carry himself now he is going from
under my roof, without any reflections upon the occasion from whence his
removal arose. This his uncle seconded, and after laying down to him his
duty to me, and what I expect of him, in a discourse of about a quarter of
an houre or more, we agreed upon his going this week, towards the latter
(end) of the week, and so dismissed him, and Mr. Blackburne and I fell to
talk of many things, wherein I did speak so freely to him in many things
agreeing with his sense that he was very open to me: first, in that of
religion, he makes it great matter of prudence for the King and Council to
suffer liberty of conscience; and imputes the losse of Hungary to the
Turke from the Emperor's denying them this liberty of their religion. He
says that many pious ministers of the word of God, some thousands of them,
do now beg their bread: and told me how highly the present clergy carry
themselves every where, so as that they are hated and laughed at by
everybody; among other things, for their excommunications, which they send
upon the least occasions almost that can be. And I am convinced in my
judgement, not only from his discourse, but my thoughts in general, that
the present clergy will never heartily go down with the generality of the
commons of England; they have been so used to liberty and freedom, and
they are so acquainted with the pride and debauchery of the present
clergy. He did give me many stories of the affronts which the clergy
receive in all places of England from the gentry and ordinary persons of
the parish. He do tell me what the City thinks of General Monk, as of a
most perfidious man that hath betrayed every body, and the King also; who,
as he thinks, and his party, and so I have heard other good friends of the